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19,669 Entries
Goaldoost 
July 13, 2023

Comments:
https://youtu.be/XpC7SVDXimg


Zinsky  
July 13, 2023

Comments:
Reading some massages prove everything we are complaining about. Completely overlook what was said and only pick one thing or another that proves our point.
I don’t think many people (or any) believe or should believe that East is better than West or vise versa. I, personally, have said it over and over. They are two sides of the same coin. Either way, they will screw us when it’s good for them.


Farzad 
July 13, 2023

Comments:
This message of mine was not posted.
 
 
Yeah. The only thing is Amrika setizi is amplified and Russia's devastating action in terms of tamamiat arzi and what they are doing is taken lightly or not mentioned at all. This Russia interference is also blamed on USA and Russia is not blamed or mentioned at all.
 
 
Seeing this from Amrika setiz people is a no brainer and you can easily see it in various posts. Yesterday Russia claimed the three islands belongs to Emirates. An emirates which was not in existence as a country when Iran claimed those islands. None said anything or condemn it. Now if Israel or US claimed anything like that we would not have heard the end of it.
 
 
Amrika setizi has become a disease. A disease stemmed from the so called roshanfekrs of the 70s.


Farzad 
July 13, 2023

Comments:
I blame people's lack of political education, being blind to see what was happening and the progress being made, and relying on rumors and stuff. When I was a kid a toodehee relative mentioned that Samad Behrangi was drowned and killed by SAVAK. And we just took his words. Or even Shariati was killed by SAVAK. But now facts show otherwise.
 
 
The other disappointing group was Nehzat Azadi branch of jebhe Melli. Bazargn was doing mobArezeh against estebdad. What happens? They overthrow the shah and he becomes prime minister. Then he sees where the shit is going and then he quits. He not only quits as prime minister, but he quits his mobarezeh. MobArezeh was only against the Shah and once achieved there was no more mobArezeh against estebdad.
 
 
That's your roshanfekr.
 
anyways below video is by a research historian. Good to get a perspective. It is from 10 yes ago. 


kAmkAr 
July 13, 2023

Comments:
A disclaimer,
لطفاً حمل بر بی ادبی نشه که بنده لغت جان رو در خطاب به دوستان استفاده نمیکنم.


kAmkAr  
July 13, 2023

Comments:
Well said Zinsky. I do agree with Farzad on his point about our so called "intellectuals". I'd like to call them Assholes :) Especially likes of Shariati, Ale Ahmad, etc. They really screwed up. I think that we as people did our unwilling damage. There were forces behind the revolution and we became tools to achieve their goals. And yes, these things start and you never know what the outcome will be. In our case the results were disastrous.


Farzad 
July 13, 2023

Comments:
https://youtu.be/dl2mvaAKy3g


Zinsky  
July 13, 2023

Comments:
One last thing before I go make money for the big guy!
The argument isn’t and shouldn’t be about West is better or worse for Iran. We have been screwed by both sides over and over for hundreds of years, if not longer.
There are no friendly sides when it comes to our interests. We need to take care of our own interests.
I’ve been reading and listening to Alan Watts for few years. One thing that I take away from his teaching is that there are no separation between black and white. One can’t exist without the other. Most of us have been thought that white is light and black is darkness. They are both exist and coexist and without one, the other one would disappear. East and West need each other. They will always be in conflict but no side can win, nor should they.


Zinsky  
July 13, 2023

Comments:
kAmkAr Jaan,
That is very true. I might have mentioned this multiple times. When it comes to international relationships and politics, it’s almost impossible to have all the facts and information. Even the ones planning it know that it will be always unknowns.
It’s not always about what happens but the intent. Even the brightest minds (believe me, I’m not anywhere close to that) know they can only plan and get things going. What happens is not exactly science. There are too many variables to control.
With all that said, there are patterns. Very few, if any, movements in international conflicts starts organically (at least for the past few hundred years). They are mainly planned by some group of people/countries and most are not what they look like to average people.
Iran, due to its location and natural resources, has been subject to so many conflicts, internally and internationally. Citizens have been used as game pieces to move the agenda of the east and the west without their knowledge.


Farzad 
July 13, 2023

Comments:
Saw this post by someone named Arash Lavasani.  Interesting view.

شاه فقط مصدق را عزل کرد، اتفاقاتی که در 28 مرداد افتاد در واقع جنگ دو ایدئولوژی فعال در کشور بود، کمونیسم و علیه کمونیسم، و اسلامیست ها به رهبری کاشانی در 28 مرداد، از حزب توده که در کنار مصدق بودند، زهر چشم گرفتند، و همین موضوع باعث شد کمونیست ها به قدرت و نفوذ اسلامیست ها پی بردند و تغییر ماهیت دادند و به کمونیست _اسلامیست(همان چیزی که شاه می گفت مارکسیست های اسلامی) تبدیل شوند و با کمک اسلامیست ها حکومت شاه را سرنگون کنند، یعنی همان هدفی که در دولت مصدق موفق نشدند به انجام برسانند.
تاکید بر واژه ی کودتا هم توسط دو گروه عمده انجام می شود، یکی مخالفان داخلی دولت شاهنشاهی مثل چپها و ملی مذهبی ها، که سعی می کنند مصدق را آنقدر بزرگ کنند تا بتوانند در پشت مصدق پناه بگیرند و با خاندان پهلوی مبارزه کنند، و دیگری دستگاه های تبلیغاتی دولت های استعماری که حکومت شاهنشاهی در ایران را مغایر با سیاست های جهانی خودشان مثل گلوبالیزم و... می دانند


Farzad 
July 13, 2023

Comments:
Not sure who said that on TV the other day. But was right on the money.
سعی کنیم خودمان را مطلع کنیم. با خواندن کتاب با تاریخ خواندن. سعی نکنیم فقط به حرف این و آن و تبلوید و شایعات تکیه کنیم. مسئولیت همه مان است که‌حقیقت جو باشیم.


kAmkAr 
July 13, 2023

Comments:
I was hoping for another USA Mexico final but that's not happening. Mexico took care of business against Jamaica. This Jamaica team had the potential to win this title easily. Their problem is what TM had in 2006 world cup which was deep division within the team players. My son was telling me during the game that half of the team's players are born in England and the other half in Jamaica. That has become a huge source of conflict amongst them just like the split we saw among Daei and Karimi in 2006 and players from the two groups were not even passing the ball to each other.


kAmkAr  
July 13, 2023

Comments:
For the current civil discussion that's going on, I have a bit of metaphor to share. I get fascinated watching the documentaries of air crashes. Experts keep emphasizing that in every single case there has to be multiple reasons going wrong for an airplane to go down. Some of which are pilot mistakes, weather conditions, airplane mechanical problems, etc... I strongly believe in both occasions of 32 and 57 we faced a perfect storm analogy for what happened in our country. I believe that Farzad and Zinsky are both right and the only difference is about the way every single individual sees and perceives important events such as Mordad 32 and Bahman 57. There were many factors involved. We can not blame one side and ignore the others.


Farzad 
July 13, 2023

Comments:
You know after Russia claiming that the 3 islands of tombs and Abu Moosa belongs to Emirates, all chapi and lefties went to soorakh moosh without condemning the Russians. 

Amrika Setiz people also did not condemn what Russia did yesterday. They won’t even if you twist their arm.


Farzad 
July 13, 2023

Comments:

Well put Shahin.  I think once we shift our focus from shallow way of thinking associated with rumors, akse EmAm, and daei jan napelon mentality of thinking to actually documented sequence of events researched by credible movvarekhin like Abbas Milani, Touraj Atabaki, or  Amir Taheri the reality becomes clear.  


I learned so much about 28 mordad actually. And even calling it a coup was wrong. Mossadegh made one major mistake and did a miscalculation with a heavy price. Below is a summary of it.

کودتا در عرف علوم سیاسی به معنای به دست آوردن قدرت به صورت غیرقانونی از طریق قوای نظامی است.

برای فهم حقیقت یا غیرواقعی بودن کودتا باید بررسی کرد که آیا بر اساس قانون اساسی مشروطه، رفتارهای دولت در برخورد با دکتر مصدق کودتا بوده است یا خیر؟ در قانون اساسی مشروطه، عزل و نصب نخست وزیر از اختیارات شاه محسوب می شد. به مرور عرف و رویه، یک قید به این اختیار وارد شد و پیش شرط این اختیار«رأی تمایل مجلس» در نظر گرفته شد. بنابراین شاه شخصی را به نخست وزیری منصوب نمی کرد، آن کسی که مجلس به وی به عنوان نخست وزیر رأی تمایل داده بود. این قید منوط به وجود مجلس بود. اما اگر مجلس به هر علتی وجود نداشت، اختیار شاه بدون نیاز به رأی تمایل مجلس اعمال می شد.

در دولت مصدق عملا مجلسی که قرار بود با ۱۳۶ نماینده به تقنین بپردازد، با ۷۹ نماینده به کار خود ادامه داد که در میان این ۷۹ نماینده اکثریت از طرفداران دکتر مصدق بودند که این اکثریت ۵۲ نفری در روزهای آخرتیرماه ۱۳۳۲ از نمایندگی مجلس استعفا دادند تا مسیر برگزاری رفراندوم انحلال مجلس تسهیل شود. به هر دلیلی با هر توجیهی دکتر مصدق در بیست ودوم تیرماه ۱۳۳۲ زمان بندی خود را برای برگزاری انتخابات در دوازدهم مرداد در تهران و در نوزدهم مرداد در شهرستان ها اعلام کرد. 

انتخابات برگزار شد و نتیجه انتخابات روز بیست و دوم مرداد ۱۳۳۲ از رادیو ایران پخش شد. با انحلال مجلس دیگر دست محمد رضا پهلوی جهت عزل مصدق با منع قانونی مواجه نبود. این بزرگ‌ترین اشتباه مصدق بود.

دستور عزل مصدق از طرف  محمدرضا پهلوی در ۲۳ مرداد ابلاغ شد و در ۲۴ مرداد به دکتر مصدق اعلام شد. اتفاقا دکتر مصدق در جلسات دادگاه بر این نکته تأکید می کند که دست خط رسید و وی در برابر دستور عزل تمکین (قبول) کرده.

بنابراین دیگر ایشان بعد از ۲۵ مرداد هیچ منصب قانونی در کشور دارا نبود تا علیه آن کسی کودتا یا وی را از شغلی با قدرت نظامی برکنار کند.

Now, come and try explaining these documented facts to those who are stuck with other beliefs. 

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